HC at the NAB: More Than Spots, Less Than Clutter
By Holland Cooke
Consultant
Radio sells advertisers our listeners’ attention. For a hundred years, our inventory has largely been commercials. Now, as our wandering audience leads us to more revenue channels, are we hooked on spots?
“We’re still in the same business. What’s changed is the tool box.”
Salem Media Group EVP, operations and revenue development Linnae Young was among panelists exploring “The Local Advertising Buying Landscape: What are Clients Buying, and how are Radio Sellers Succeeding or Missing Out?” Her laser-like focus is on the client’s need: “The HVAC company has two trucks and wants six.”
Ditto from session moderator Mike Hulvey, the Radio Advertising Bureau’s president & CEO. He called pitching a multi-store McDonald’s franchisee, who heard-him-out, then asked “Will that idea sell a hamburger?”
We sure have ideas. Researcher Gordon Borrell reckons that “the biggest mistake radio stations are making is underestimating the potential [of digital].” Many now sell video advertising. Prospects “don’t have any questions about radio, other than ‘Can you lower the price?’ They have lots of questions about digital.” Be their guide.
And obsess on outcomes. “Stop with the tactics,” urges Marketron senior director of digital strategy Dustin Wilson. “It’s all about solutions-based selling.”
“As radio has encountered increased pressure on revenue, it has often increased spot loads.”
Ad nauseam, in the view of Edison Research co-founder & president Larry Rosin, whose Ted Talk-type session “Considering Spot Loads” was plainspoken.
Radio has violated what Larry calls “The Commercial Broadcast Bargain” – the unspoken deal that content is worth the time spent listening to ads. “We’ve tilted the bargain in an unfair way,” he said, pointing to “fewer, but much longer breaks; and many, many [music] stations now loading all their spots into two interminable breaks per hour.”
Rosin’s team has long tracked listening habits through its Infinite Dial series, and the trend is clear: Radio’s “Share of Ear” never fully recovered after the pandemic; and commercial loads went up during that time.
“The real problem” is not understanding how ‘Infinite’ today’s ‘Dial’ is, “ignoring the fact that there are other things to listen to.” Ad loads tend to be shorter in podcasts and in non-paid streams. These ad-supported competitors never run more than two spots back-to-back. And increasingly, Americans are paying for ad-free content, via SiriusXM, Spotify, YouTube Premium, and others.
Solutions? Larry was clear: “What I’m NOT saying: ‘cut the load and charge more’ in today’s low-demand environment.”
— Even if you can’t lower total inventory, consider more shorter breaks. “Listeners have, or at least had, an internal clock: song (3 minutes) – song (3 minutes) – song (3 minutes) – break (3 minutes). When you ask music radio consumers, a break should be the length of a song. The two long breaks clock simply can’t be the best we can do for advertisers.”
— Bonus on Rating, not Share, which would “reorient radio programmers to consider ALL competitors, not just other local stations. Radio’s insular world hurts it.”
— Don’t demonize commercials – “a disservice to advertisers” – the way we seem to when we call the stop set “a break;” or tout commercial-free hours to pump-up a daypart (then overdose the load in adjacent hours).
— Improve the quality of commercials.
Holland Cooke (HollandCooke.com) is a consultant working the intersection of broadcasting and the Internet. Follow HC on Twitter @HollandCooke and connect on LinkedIn
representative survey of over 4,000 people “identifies a significant identity crisis driven by the convergence of audio-only content and video formats popularized by platforms like YouTube and Spotify.” It shows: 1) 72% of Americans 12+ consider recordings of people discussing any topic on YouTube that are also available as audio-only shows elsewhere to be a podcast; 2) Advertisers face significant barriers to investment due to inconsistent standards, fragmented reporting, and unclear attribution; and 3) A clear, shared definition and interoperable measurement are urgently needed to realize podcasting’s full economic potential. Regarding defining podcasts, they propose new working definitions as follows: Podcast (noun): “An on-demand audio-driven program featuring episodic content across wide-ranging themes and formats. Traditionally delivered via open RSS and conversational in nature, it can include platform-based distribution and is commonly supplemented by video.” And Video Podcast (noun): “An episodic, on-demand program centered on spoken-word content, where synchronized visuals meaningfully shape the experience.” 
$171 billion local advertising marketplace. The study reveals that “key categories are driving investments in radio advertising: investment & retirement, quick service restaurants, supermarkets, commercial banking and hospitals. BIA VP of insights and analysis Celine Matthiessen adds, “Notably, hospitals are projected to be one of the top spenders in local radio advertising in 2025, according to our advertising forecast. As they allocate parts of their media budgets to Radio Over-the-Air (OTA), 
Radio Digital and other platforms like Connected TV (CTV), it’s evident that local radio continues to be a trusted and culturally relevant medium, especially in rural and remote communities.” RAB president and CEO Mike Hulvey comments, “Our continued partnership with BIA allows RAB membership insights into opportunity across local advertising categories. Broadcast radio and its digital assets can deliver the services that local businesses want and need to increase their sales revenue. Local businesses across sectors are dependent upon marketing professionals to help guide their growth. Understanding challenges of advertising categories and potential opportunities that exist is the value that this information brings to RAB members and to their prospective advertisers.” RAB and BIA will host, “Radio Ad Forecast 2025: BIA’s Latest Projections,” at 1:00 pm ET on April 16, for RAB members. 
in Cape Town — in which the broadcasters shared ideas about better serving their communities, the broadcasters came together to record an original song co-written and produced by broadcast engineer Dr. Andy Gladding EdD (WRHU-FM and Salem Media Group New York). The song is performed by DJs from “Bush Radio” and WKZE, Red Hook, New York. 
month: KFNX, Phoenix; KMZQ, Las Vegas; KERN, Bakersfield; KSMA, Santa Maria, and WNJD, Cape May, New Jersey. KFNX owner Bill Brady says, “‘Armstrong and Getty’ bring it all: They are funny, knowledgeable, insightful, and always play the hits. They are the prototype of the modern radio talk show. We are thrilled to have them on KFNX. They are a great addition to our lineup.”
had a storied career in Chicago media. First at newspapers, he moved to television in 1963 working at WBBM as a news writer, reporter and political editor. From 1973 to 1982, Jacobson co-anchored WBBM-TV’s “The 10 O’Clock News” with Bill Kurtis and the two dominated the ratings for nine years. His “Perspective” pieces date to those newscasts when Jacobson would deliver them live from his office. WGN Radio VP and general manager Mary Sandberg Boyle comments, “I ‘knew’ Walter Jacobson mostly for his TV news work virtually all my life. He and Bill Kurtis revolutionized the look and feel of television news broadcasts in Chicago at CBS 2 and it’s still talked about by those who watched them in the 70s. Working with him at WGN Radio and getting to know him in-person has been an honor. After seeing firsthand his uncompromising devotion to his craft, it’s easy to see why he is the media legend that he is. Walter’s personality, contributions and ever unique ‘Perspective’ will be greatly missed.”
include: Megan Thee Stallion, Mayim Bialik, Kathy Bates, Angela Yee, Keke Palmer, Rita Cosby, Jill Schlesinger, Kristin Klingshirn, Letty Peniche and more. They will be honored at the Gracie Awards Gala on May 20, 2025, at the Beverly Wilshire in Los Angeles, which will be hosted by actress, comedian, and podcaster, Fortune Feimster. Local and student award recipients will be recognized at the Gracie Awards Luncheon on June 18 at Cipriani’s in New York City. AWMF president Becky Brooks says, “For 50 years, the Gracie Awards have honored the storytellers who push boundaries and redefine what’s possible. This is more than an awards show – it is a movement that has championed inclusion, representation, and truth in the media. The women we celebrate today are shaping the next 50 years, ensuring that our narratives are not just seen or heard, but felt and remembered. And we are excited to have Fortune Feimster join us as the host for our Golden Anniversary Gala in Los Angeles, bringing her incredible wit and energy to this unforgettable celebration.” 
Thank you, TALKERS for placing me on two panels at the IBSNYC conference. All student conferences have one underlying goal: Attendees want to know how to land a starter job in media. Here’s the information I shared with the eager crowd.
reductions to ensure a strong and resilient future for the business. We are streamlining resources to stay competitive in a rapidly evolving media landscape and to best position Audacy to continue serving listeners and advertisers with excellence.” The Desk is reporting a list of those affected by the cuts and in the spoken-word formats, those people include: WINS, New York sports director Marc Ernay; KNX, Los Angeles reporter Charles Feldman; WWL, New Orleans news staffer Mark Menard; KMOX, St. Louis digital content producer Wilson Truong; and others. 
Nicole Ovadia says, “Our latest forecast indicates that local advertising is showing resilience, despite the ongoing changes in the economic landscape. Although we expect core advertising to remain stable, we’ve adjusted our outlook to account for various market factors like interest rates and consumer sentiment and significant changes in media consumption patterns that are driving digital growth.” The forecast indicates strong growth in several sectors: Real Estate at 9.3%, Restaurants at 9.2%, and Retail at 6.8%. The Education and Automotive verticals are also experiencing substantial growth, with increases of 5% each.
will air on SiriusXM’s Stars channel from 8:00 am to 10:00 am. SiriusXM president and chief content officer Scott Greenstein comments, “Page Six has been a powerhouse for all celebrity news for nearly half a century, and by teaming up with our in-house experts here at SiriusXM, this new show is sure to be the ultimate destination for pop culture fans. With the launch of ‘Page Six Radio,’ we are transforming the publication’s stories to a dynamic new format that will expand its reach and resonate with SiriusXM listeners who turn to the platform for all the latest entertainment news.”
tapings and discussions aimed at aspiring podcasters in the Black community. He says, “We’re excited to return to Atlanta, building on the incredible momentum of the podcast industry and the growing impact of Black creators in the space. As the influence of Black voices continues to shape culture and drive conversations, The Black Effect remains committed to powerful storytelling, meaningful brand collaborations and unforgettable live experiences. This year, we’re celebrating not just where we’ve been – we’re embracing the limitless future of Black podcasting and the influence it holds.”
“weaponizing language through their stylebook to push a partisan worldview in contrast with the traditional and deeply held beliefs of many Americans and many people around the world.” RTDNA president and CEO Dan Shelley states, “The current White House moves targeting one of the world’s oldest and most respected news outlets are outrageous and unacceptable. It is the Trump administration, and not the Associated Press, that is trying to contort facts so that they align with its often divisive, and sometimes completely erroneous, version of the truth. We protest the administration’s actions in this instance and object to its effort to shape shift legitimate fact-based journalism to better resemble its alternative versions of the truth.”
iHeartMedia St. Louis announced today (2/11)that media veteran Libby Nolan has been named market president, effective immediately. Nolan will oversee all aspects of sales and programming for the St. Louis cluster, driving business strategy and revenue growth. A highly respected veteran with 30 years in the radio industry, Nolan’s expertise spans programming, sales, marketing and executive leadership, giving her a well-rounded perspective on the evolving radio landscape. She will report to John Karpinski, division president for iHeartMedia. “Libby’s exceptional leadership, extensive industry knowledge and passion for innovation have driven tremendous local growth across both our radio and digital offerings. With experience spanning nearly every role in a radio station, she is uniquely positioned to lead from a place of deep understanding and drive continued success,” said Karpinski.
Just hours after the series of devastating wildfires broke out in Los Angeles, iHeart LA and the Dream Center – a resource center focused on providing support to those affected by homelessness, hunger and crisis – launched a national and local media campaign that asked local listeners to contribute essential items and cash to support those affected by the fires, many of whom had lost everything. 
What followed was an outpouring of love and support that exceeded any expectation, and which – thanks to the generosity of friends, neighbors and communities – has become one of the largest grassroots giving efforts in iHeart’s history.
The Miami Marlins announced this morning (2/7) the hiring of Jack McMullen as the lead play-by-play announcer on the Marlins Radio Network. McMullen takes over for Kyle Sielaff, who is the 
It says, “BIA will share radio ad forecasts to offer a clearer picture of what’s in store this year and which verticals are ready to spend in 2025. The advertising landscape keeps shifting, and we’re here to make sense of it all.” 
In the ever-evolving landscape of digital media, creators often walk a fine line between inspiration and infringement. The 2015 case of “Equals Three, LLC v. Jukin Media, Inc.” offers a cautionary tale for anyone producing reaction videos or commentary-based content: fair use is not a free pass, and transformation is key.
Whitepaper: The Extraordinary Cost of Dull,” the analysis notes that 1) Neutrality, the absence of emotion, is the most common reaction to ads; 2) Business-to-business ads are even duller with greater neutral “feeling nothing” responses; and 3) 
Don McLean recalls the newspaper headline on February 3, 1959: “Three Rock’n’roll Stars Killed in Plane Crash.” He says, “I cried,” telling AARP Magazine that, years later, “I had my tape machine on, and this song just came out of me: ‘A long, long time ago, I can still remember how that music used to make me smile…’”
acquisition of AMFM, took on an EVP role at Premiere Networks. He was the president of the fledgling liberal talk radio company Air America and joined Westwood One after Air America shut down in 2006. TALKERS publisher Michael Harrison states, “This is a devastating loss to the radio industry. I had the privilege of working with Gary all the way back to my music radio days when he was a young executive at the old MJI Broadcasting with major industry players like Julie Talbott and Josh Feigenbaum in the early days of our careers. He has subsequently worn a number of key management and entrepreneurial hats in the business – all reflecting his dedication to professionalism and quality. He was very well liked and respected by broadcasters on both sides of the Atlantic. He will be missed.” A service will be held on January 26, 2025 at Riverside Memorial Chapel at 180 West 76th Street, New York, NY 10023. In lieu of flowers, the family requests donations be made to the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention in Gary Krantz’s memory.
(distributed by Premiere Networks) which runs two hours per day, five days per week on stations across the nation, is one of the most innovative and well-received syndicated talk radio shows (as well as podcasts) to come down the pike in many years. It is described by Habeeb as follows: “There’s no debate or opinion. No 
politics. No news. Just stories that bring people together around common values, themes, and the founding principles and ideals of our nation. Stories that create a space for listeners to escape the news and noise of the day and be moved and informed. To listen and learn.” Habeeb’s talk show credentials are formidable. He co-founded Laura Ingraham’s national radio show in 2001, moved to Salem Media in 2008 as VP of content, and launched “Our American Stories” in 2016. He’s a University of Virginia Law School graduate, a Newsweek essayist, and lives in Oxford, Mississippi with his wife Valerie and daughter Reagan. He is currently ranked #11 on the TALKERS “Heavy Hundred” list of the 100 Most Important Radio Talk Show Hosts in America. Harrison and Habeeb engage in an illuminating conversation about the importance of history and the power of storytelling. Don’t miss this! 
cause of death is not revealed in the story. Gallo’s program, “The Gallo Radio Show,” aired on the SuperTalk network of talk stations across the state. The network issued a statement saying, “For over five decades, Paul didn’t just talk about Mississippi — he helped shape its story. Paul dedicated his life to his listeners, his state, and the pursuit of the truth. From DJ to program director, from sales and management to ownership, Paul mastered every facet of the industry.”
iHeartMedia announced today (1/17) that Joyce Wirthlin has been named market president for Salt Lake City, effective immediately. iHeartMedia Salt Lake City is home to six iconic stations featuring music, talk, and news formats on both broadcast and digital platforms. In her new role, Wirthlin will oversee all aspects of operations in Salt Lake City, including sales, promotions and programming. She will report to Nick Gnau, division president for iHeartMedia. “I am very excited to have Joyce leading this team in Salt Lake City. Since the day I started working with Joyce, I was impressed with her leadership, the culture she has built with her team and the deep knowledge of the market. I have no doubt that she will propel this team to the next level!” Gnau tells TALKERS. Wirthlin joined the company in 1998 as VP of Sales. Over the years, she advanced within the organization. Most recently she served as the SVP of sales, where she played a pivotal role shaping sales strategies, fostering team development and strengthening the company’s presence in the market. “I am deeply honored to be appointed market president of iHeartMedia Salt Lake City and grateful for the trust placed in me to lead this exceptional team,” said Wirthlin. “The people here are the core of our success. Together, we are eager to build upon our achievements and continue to shape the future of media in Salt Lake City.
Along with restructuring, WVON is ending months of speculation on who will be replacing veteran talk show host Perri Small who retired last November. WVON has tapped former politician Jesse Jackson, Jr to host its afternoon drive show. “The Jesse Jackson Jr Show” will air Monday through Thursday from 3:00 – 6:00 pm. This is Jackson Jr’s first foray into broadcasting (with support via the syndication arm of Tavis Smiley‘s Smiley Audio Media). He previously served as a U.S. Representative of Illinois’ 2nd Congressional District from 1995 to 2012. WVON’s current afternoon host, Atiba Buchanan, has agreed to continue his involvement at the station and his new role will be announced shortly. 
WVON has chosen Cleopatra Draper to replace midday host Perri Small for its coveted midday slot. Draper has worked in various capacities at WVON since 2019 including as a fill-in host. She holds a master’s in social work from the University of Illinois Chicago and has a passion for getting young people involved socially and politically in community-building. Draper’s show will air weekdays from 9:00 am-12:00 noon. In addition, WVON’s long-time host Matt McGill will be expanding his show to air weekdays from 12:00 noon until 3:00 pm, while Lynn Richardson’s hourly financial show “The Millionaire’s Roundtable” is being moved to 5:00 am as a lead-in to WVON’s morning drive show, “The Rufus Williams’ Show.” This begins a new era of talk radio for Chicago’s Black talk powerhouse which has been among the national leaders of this format since 1986. “We feel our new lineup is optimal for the changes that are occurring in our country and globally,” said company CEO, Melody Spann Cooper. “To have an opportunity to provide a platform for someone as talented as Jesse Jr and to introduce the station to a new generation of thought leaders with Cleopatra, positions WVON to continue to shake things up in Chicago and beyond.” WVON-The Talk of Chicago has established itself as one of Chicago’s premier content providers. For 61 years, the station has been considered one of the most credible African American media institutions in the nation providing an interactive forum for its vast listening audience to discuss social, economic and political issues that impact the Black community locally and nationally. WVON is a subsidiary of Midway Broadcasting Corporation, whose properties also include WRLL Radio and VONtv.
FOX News Media (FNM) will unveil a series of programming changes across FOX News Channel (FNC) and FOX Business Network (FBN), announced FNM CEO Suzanne Scott. Beginning on January 21, FOX & Friends Weekend co-host Will Cain will take over the 4 PM/ET weekday timeslot on FNC with “The Will Cain Show.” FOX News contributor Charlie Hurt will replace Cain as co-host of “FOX & Friends Weekend” beginning January 18. “The Fox Report” and “The Big Weekend Show” will both expand to two hours on Saturdays and Sundays also starting on January 18. Additionally, FBN’s Dagen McDowell will join “The Big Money Show” which will expand from 12:00 noon – 2:00 pm ET on weekdays beginning on January 27 while she also continues to co-host “The Bottom Line” (6:00 – 7:00 pm ET). In making the announcement, Scott said, “As the media landscape continues to evolve, we are always looking to innovate our programming lineup to meet the needs of our viewers, and we are confident the new lineup will best position FOX News Media for the future. Will Cain brings years of experience to the 4:00 pm hour as an accomplished broadcaster and a lawyer and we look forward to adding his insights to what will no doubt be another historic news cycle ahead this year.”
Cain added, “It has been an honor to wake up with America these past four years and I am thrilled to apply my background in news, law, entertainment and business to help our viewers better understand the headlines through thought-provoking content and analysis every weekday afternoon.”