Is the Algorithm Your New Program Director?
By Matthew B. Harrison
TALKERS, VP/Associate Publisher
Harrison Legal Group, Senior Partner
Goodphone Communications, Executive Producer
You post five clips from yesterday’s program. Four do fine. The fifth, an argument with a caller, explodes. It gets more views, more comments, more shares and more click time than anything else you posted.
So tomorrow you post another argument.
That one performs too. Before long, you are clipping more confrontations because confrontation travels. Then maybe the show itself begins to change. You stay on the angry topic a little longer. You take the provocative call you might once have dumped. You learn what gets rewarded.
Nobody at YouTube, Facebook or TikTok called and told you to make an angrier show. The algorithm did not order you to do anything. It simply showed you what produced a reaction, and you reacted to the reward.
Radio people have seen versions of this forever. The phones light up, so we stay with the topic. A feature appears to perform well in PPM, so it gets another quarter hour. Ratings rise, so management asks for more of whatever seems to be working.
Digital distribution makes that feedback faster, more visible and harder to ignore. It also adds another wrinkle: the platform may use strong engagement to give the next clip more distribution. The reward is not just a good number on a report. It may be a bigger audience tomorrow.
That makes analytics tremendously useful. They can show what attracts attention, what holds audience and what helps people discover your program. But a measurement tool can become a programming influence if you start chasing every spike.
A good host learns from the audience without becoming a hostage to it. A good programmer knows what works without assuming that whatever gets the biggest reaction is automatically the best show.
Use the algorithm to distribute your work. Learn from what it tells you. Make money wherever the audience finds you.
Just don’t appoint it the role of program director.
For the larger discussion of ratings, PPM and digital distribution, read The Algorithm Is Listening at TALKERS.com here.
Matthew B. Harrison, associate publisher of TALKERS, is a media and intellectual property attorney who advises radio hosts, content creators, and creative entrepreneurs. He has written extensively on fair use, AI law, and the future of digital rights. Reach him at Matthew@HarrisonLegalGroup.com or read more at TALKERS.com.
Cumulus Media’s WSKO-AM, Syracuse “The Score 1260,” where he previously hosted the morning drive program. Station program director Rick Roberts says, “We’re excited to welcome Goz back to ‘The Score 1260.’ His football expertise, broadcasting experience, and Central New York roots make him a perfect fit for our lineup and for Bills fans throughout the region.”
Now, the station announces that Malloy is returning to the station on July 13 to resume his role as co-host of the “Dennis & Judi Show.” This change doesn’t put Franco’s current co-host Eric Johnson out on the street. The former, longtime “New Jersey 101.5” program director is returning to management as operations manager and program director. He will serve as a fill-in talk host on the station and will spin records during
the station’s weekend music programs. Johnson says, “So here is where we are. Dennis and Judi are back together on July 13. I am moving into a role that lets me put 48 years of experience to work shaping what New Jersey radio sounds like across three markets. And I will still be here, writing about this state I have loved my whole life, and showing up on the air when you need a familiar voice.”
program. WPEN-FM “97.5 The Fanatic” program director Scott Masteller states, “John has brought tremendous passion, professionalism, and authenticity to our morning show and to the Philadelphia sports community. He’s been an important part of the station’s success, and we’re grateful for everything he has contributed both on the air and behind the scenes. We fully support his decision and wish him and his family nothing but the very best in this next chapter.” About his decision to leave the show, Kincade says, “After a great deal of thought, I’ve decided that this summer will be the right time for me to step away from mornings at ‘The Fanatic.’ This decision comes after a lot of reflection following my cancer battle and thinking carefully about what’s best for me and my family moving forward. I’m incredibly grateful to Beasley, to my teammates, and most importantly to the Philadelphia listeners who welcomed me back home in 2021 and supported me every step of the way. I’m proud of what we’ve built on the morning show and very confident in the future of ‘The Fanatic.’ There’s a tremendous team here both on-air and behind the scenes. I’m not retiring, and I’m excited to eventually explore what comes next professionally. Philadelphia has meant so much to me, and I can’t thank the fans enough for their support, especially during my health journey.”
Jay Clark was the first program director of WABC as a talk station. He set the tone and path for modern talk radio. This week I had Jay on as a special guest on the Red Apple Audio Networks all night show, “The Other Side of Midnight.” We celebrated the anniversary, May 10, (1982) of WABC’s switch from music to talk on the giant signal at 770 AM.
format in America. KGO was the killer biller in San Francisco. The execs who ran them were mighty proud: Ben Hoberman, Ed McLaughlin, Al Racco, Chuck Debere. Yes, they ran those stations, but they also invented the caller-driven talk format. There were other winning talk stations, but they were guest centric rather than listener centric (i.e. WOR, WGN). At the time, there were 43 stations listed as “talk” stations. 43. Not many models.
1300” in New Haven. iHeartMedia SVP of programming Dylan Sprague says, “Michael’s energy, passion and leadership make him a strong fit to lead our Sports and Talk portfolio in Hartford and New Haven. These are powerful brands and we’re excited to build on their success under Michael’s leadership.” Johnson comments, “I am thrilled to begin this next chapter at iHeart. Sports fans are passionate and engaged. I am eager to grow all of the stations, deepen the connections with listeners and continue expanding our digital presence.”
assumed the operations manager role at the company’s WMAL-FM, Washington. Cumulus regional vice president Larry Blumhagen states, “Art has proven to be exceptionally dedicated and creative in his years as APD for KABC. We are eager to watch him bring those qualities to the role of program director for KABC and KSFO.” Webb comments, “I’m excited to step into this role and build on the strong foundation already in place at both stations. Our focus remains on creating engaging, relevant content that truly connects with California listeners while continuing to elevate the incredible work of our talented teams. With such outstanding rosters in Los Angeles and San Francisco, I’m looking forward to sharing in much success together.”
breathe talk radio? We’re looking for a program director to lead our talk radio stations to the next level.
According to the study, 22.07% (2366 stations) had women holding the general manager position in 2025. This is a slight increase from last year where the number was 21.67% and compared to 2004 continues to show solid growth when the percentage of female general managers was only 14.9%. MIW says, “Overall, the best management opportunities for women in radio continues to be in sales management. 35.31% (3561 stations) had a woman sales manager in 2025 which is basically flat from 35.67% in 2024. The greatest challenge for women in radio management continues to be in the area of program directors/brand managers. Women currently program 13.02% (289 stations) which is a slight gain from 12.38% in 2024. MIW board president Sheila Kirby comments, “Twenty-five years of data give us clarity. We are encouraged to see movement in general manager and programming roles, particularly within the Top 100 markets. At the same time, flat growth in sales leadership and the continued underrepresentation of women in programming nationally remind us that progress is not automatic. Sustainable advancement requires intention. MIW remains committed to mentoring, advocating, and creating pathways for women to lead at every level of the industry.”
will support our strong team and help WHO continue delivering the high-quality programming listeners rely on every day.” Henson most recently served with Cumulus Media as PD and morning host at classic rock WLAV-FM and country WTNR-FM in Grand Rapids, Michigan. During his career he’s programmed news/talk outlets including WRVA, Richmond; WPGB-FM, Pittsburgh; and WOWO, Fort Wayne. Henson comments, “I’m incredibly excited to return to iHeartMedia and work with the legendary staff at NewsRadio 1040 WHO. WHO’s legacy of trusted news and strong local voices is unmatched, and I’m focused on building on that foundation and continuing to deliver relevant, impactful programming for listeners across Iowa.”
Benjamin Yount is taking over the 6:00 am to 9:00 am show hosting duties. Yount has been with the station since 2018 as host and news director. He comments, “WISN has always been about serving Wisconsin with smart, honest conversation, and I’m honored to take on 
morning drive. Our listeners count on us to start their day informed and engaged, and I’m excited to continue that in a new time slot while keeping the same commitment to strong local coverage.” Jason Goch, who has been a fill-in host on WISN, moves into the morning news anchor and late morning talk host role. He’ll handle news duties during Yount’s program and host his own talk show from 9:00 am to 11:00 am. Station program director Jerry Bott states, “This lineup builds on WISN’s momentum and reflects our focus on serving listeners with strong, credible voices throughout the day. Benjamin has earned the trust of our audience and brings proven ratings success to morning drive, while Jason is a terrific addition whose experience and versatility strengthen our local programming bench.”
show alongside Ted Woodward, has worked his entire 55-year career in the Wichita market. He got his start in 1970 at KWBB as a news anchor and moved to KEYN-FM in the mid-1970s as news director. He joined KNSS in 1998 as news director and eventually became program director at the station. During his career he’s won numerous awards, including a Marconi Award for Outstanding Talent. Audacy Wichita SVP and market manager Tommy Castor says, “Steve’s name is synonymous with Wichita radio. His leadership, integrity, and unmatched storytelling have shaped this station and enriched the lives of our listeners for more than half a century.” McIntosh comments, “It has been the honor of my life to share Kansas news and Kansas stories with Kansas people. Thank you to everyone who has been part of this incredible journey.” The station will present a public farewell broadcast on December 12. 
position the cluster for continued success and growth. They include the promotion of Grant McHill to program director for “NewsRadio 101.1 FM KXL.” McHill has been serving as KXL’s news director. McHill says, “As someone who has worked at KXL for a decade, I appreciate and understand the station’s importance to the community and its potential for growth in Portland and beyond. I am thrilled, honored, and thankful for this opportunity. A huge thank you to Jeff Warshaw, Keith Dakin, Mark Handwerger, and Ross MacLeod for their confidence in me.”
show, “Hoops Talk.” Sliwa will provide expert insight, analysis and commentary across AM 570 LA SPORTS content throughout the NBA season, including featured segments available on the iHeartRadio app. Sliwa previously served on the Lakers Radio broadcast in pre-game, halftime, and post-game coverage. KLAC program director Brian Long says, “Allen is one of the premier voices covering the Lakers. With the excitement surrounding the team this season, his perspective and passion will be a great addition to our coverage and valuable voice for Lakers fans in Southern California and across the country.”
November 10 at the age of 51. Adams, whose real name was Michael Paul Kunkle, began his media career in the print industry at the Harrison City Post (PA) while in high school. He transitioned to radio and served with stations including WBT-AM/FM, Charlotte; KTRH-AM, Houston, WYAY-FM, Atlanta and KDKA-AM, Pittsburgh, where he was program director. He launched his consultancy, Marshall Adams Media, in 2012.
Civic Media’s news/talk network, managing schedules, talent, quality control, and compliance with broadcast regulations. Key responsibilities include selecting programs, coaching on-air personalities and shows, developing promotional strategies, and ensuring the station’s sound and content align with its brand and audience needs. They blend creativity and business acumen, using audience research and ratings data to shape programming and achieve business goals.” 
director, I have submitted my notice. I’m grateful to Connoisseur Media, a fantastic company that, at the time, owned WFMD, and to Frank Mitchell, who hired me and trained me, for the opportunity to be part of this legendary station, and to my close friend and mentor, Bob Miller. My passion for radio is strong, and I look forward to returning to the airwaves as soon as my time at WFMD comes to an end. I love the radio industry. Who knows where this journey will take me next, but I hope it will still be in this area. You will hear me on the air again one day, because my radio career is NOT over. I still have a month here, and I am looking forward to finishing my time here. Primarily working with the fantastic team that I get to work with every day.”
co-host of the midday show alongside longtime station personality Judi Franco. Johnson – who served as the station’s program director from 1999 through 2017 – 
takes over for Dennis Malloy who retired from the program last week. Johnson says, “Coming back to ‘New Jersey 101.5’ feels like coming home. This station has always had a one-of-a-kind connection to the people of New Jersey. I’m honored to be part of it again — and even more excited to team up with Judi Franco, who’s as sharp, fearless, and funny as they come.” Townsquare Media regional VP Brian Lang says, “Eric is the perfect choice to join Judi on middays. He’s got a longstanding relationship with her, understands the power of the ‘New Jersey 101.5’ brand, and brings instant chemistry to the mic. We couldn’t be more excited — I can’t wait to hear ‘The Judi & EJ Show’ in action.”
21.67% of stations had women in the general manager position, a decline of half a point from last year, but a large increase from 2004 when 14.9% of stations had a female GM. MIW says the best management opportunities for women in radio continues to be in sales management as 35.67% of stations had a woman sales manager in 2024, up more than a full percentage point from 2023. When it comes to programming, MIW says the greatest challenge for women in radio management continues to be in the area of program directors/brand managers. Women currently program 12.38% of stations, a slight gain from 11.50% in 2023. MIW board president Sheila Kirby comments, “While we are encouraged by the progress in sales management and programming, the overall numbers show that there is still significant work to be done. Leadership opportunities for women in radio must continue to grow, and our mission at MIW remains steadfast – empowering, mentoring, and advocating for more women to rise into key decision-making roles across the industry.”
Departments, sheriff of Bernalillo County, head of public safety for the State of New Mexico under Governor Gary Johnson. Cumulus Albuquerque vice president and market manager Jeff Berry states, “I am SO excited for Darren’s return to Cumulus Albuquerque as program director. His passion for radio and vision for the future are contagious. We are fortunate to have someone with his background re-join our industry in a leadership position. Welcome home, Darren!” White comments, “I am honored to accept the position of program director for News Radio KKOB and KNML the Sports Animal, and I am humbled by the confidence Cumulus Media has placed in me for this exciting new challenge. Having been a part of Cumulus for over a decade, I have seen firsthand the incredible dedication and talent of the teams at both stations. With a proven history of delivering provocative, engaging, and informative radio that is second to none, I look forward to building on that legacy by attracting new listeners and continuing to bring dynamic programming to our loyal radio family.”
Fayetteville, Arkansas “92.1 The Ticket.” Gee most recently served as assistant program director and co-host of the “Pat Jones Show” on KYAL-FM, Tulsa. Cumulus Fayetteville regional VP and market manager Keith Liesmann says, “Erik’s depth of experience and passion for sports make him a perfect fit for our station. We are thrilled to have him on board and can’t wait for our listeners to experience his insight and energy every morning.” Levi Peckenpaugh will serve as producer for the morning drive program.
and podcasts are all a part of what we do, so show us what you’ve got. The successful candidate will be responsible for all aspects of programming including scheduling content, coaching on-air staff, station and AM/FM cluster strategy, development of on-air/online promotions and generating associated revenue, oversight and content creation for digital extensions (including streams, websites and podcasts), and have a strong customer service approach towards listeners, staff, & sales. Additionally, the candidate will act as the program director for Legendary News Radio KKOB and KNML The Sports Animal. 
Spacciapolli states, “I first want to congratulate Dave on an incredible career. It has been a privilege to work with him over the past two years. We’re delighted to promote PJ, a mainstay at KDKA for the last 35 years. The trust he has built within our organization and with listeners and partners makes him a great fit to steward this iconic brand into the future as we grow on many levels.” Kumanchik, who has worked in multiple capacities at both KDKA News Radio and “93.7 The Fan” (KDKA-FM) as news producer and editor, morning show producer, sports producer and program director, comments, “I look forward to working with our leadership team, including Michael, to boost the momentum we have created at KDKA News Radio in the past couple of years. As the Voice of Pittsburgh, we will continue to provide news-driven talk that encourages interactions from our listeners.”
Monticello Media’s WCHV-AM, Charlottesville, Virginia, is acquiring WTON-AM, Staunton, Virginia and two FM translators (W255DS, Harrisonburg at 98.9 and W266BQ, Crozet at 101.1) from Stu-Comm, Inc. for $275,000. Thomas is buying the station via his company Thomas Media LLC. After Monticello Media learned of the deal, it severed its relationship with Thomas. He tells TALKERS magazine, “We are looking forward to bringing local news and conversation back to the valley the same way we did for WCHV. We also hope to have my show back on the air in Charlottesville soon.”
been serving as assistant program director and executive producer. iHeartMedia San Diego market president Noreen Ippolito says, “Mary has been a part of our cluster for many years and is more than ready to take the lead role of our talk stations. She’s smart, experienced, and incredibly detailed with her work.” Ayala comments, “This is an exciting time to be taking over the program director position for these brands. Each station has its own distinct flavor, and all of them are filled with great talent I’m looking forward to working with.”