The Damning Myth of Spoken Word Radio: High Time Spent Listening (TSA) and Low Cume
By Walter Sabo
Consultant, Sabo Media
A.K.A. Walter Sterling
Radio Host, “Sterling On Sunday”
Talk Media Network
Dependency upon a PPM panel to deliver high time spent listening is a bad business model. Would you rather count on one person listening for one hour or four people listening for 15 minutes? Right.
A good music format program director knows exactly how to program talk radio in a PPM environment. Oddly, when a music programmer has the privilege of programming a talk station they seem to forget all of their programming knowledge. Both formats are measured by exactly the same technology and therefore if it “works” in music, it works in talk.
The reason “New Jersey 101.5” quickly became the highest cuming FM talk station in the world – for 20+ years – is because when Bob McAllan, Jay Sorensen, Perry Simon, John Dziuba and I designed it, we had a simple process: Build a music station that takes a lot of phone calls. It was always programmed like a top 40 station and 33 years later it obviously worked.
The reason “Real Radio 104.1 in Orlando” was the only Howard Stern station that did not suffer the expense of having to change format when he was recruited to SiriusXM Satellite Radio was because the station was built as a heavily formatted music station that took a lot of phone calls. Note that Real Radio 104.1 and New Jersey 101.5 both air music non-stop on the weekends for the single purpose of targeting a specific cume demographic. It obviously worked.
What are the key elements of a music format that should be applied to talk in order to build cume?
- Please, god, don’t flag the “breaks.”
- Every show had a specific pace based on topic set up time and call length time which gave the station a consistent rhythm and sound. All day.
- No “records” from home! No personal sound effects, jingles or that crap.
- Constantly sell ahead. No yesterday calls, yesterday references. Sell what’s next.
- Assume every single listener just tuned in. Explain the topic and give the phone number obsessively.
- Listener driven not host driven. Every host is valuable and gifted but if a host makes the mistake of quitting, the interest needs and tastes of the listener are constant and can be reflected by the next host. A constant.
Mickey Luckoff, the brilliant president of KGO, San Francisco for decades explained why he hired most of his hosts from top 40 radio because, “I can teach them TALK but I can’t teach them radio.” BTW yes, even 34-year morning host Jim Dunbar worked at WLS and KQV as a top 40 jock immediately before joining KGO to host a talk show.
Walter Sabo was a pioneer in the concept of targeted talk which allows a station to precisely reach a chosen demographic. He has had a robust list of consulting clients including, SiriusXM Satellite Radio, Conde Naste, CBS, Press Broadcasting, RKO General, Hearst, Fred Silverman Productions, and many more. His company HITVIEWS was the first major player to recognize and monetize online video stars known as “influencers.” He is on the nominating board of the Radio Hall of Fame. Reach him at 646.678.1110 or walter@sabomedia.com. Discover Sabo’s network radio show here: waltersterlingshow.com.
me that they intend to be the most conservative radio station in America. I just didn’t fit the bill anymore.” Although Howell doesn’t profess to be conservative or liberal, he’s been a talk host for years (in addition to his work at country outlet WUSN-FM), not only with WLS-AM but with Salem Media Group’s crosstown conservative news/talk WIND-AM. However, he’s made no bones about his contempt for former President Donald Trump. He laments to Axios, “Nobody broadcasts anymore. Everybody narrowcasts.” WLS-AM has not revealed its permanent plans for the afternoon drive daypart other than to slide the syndicated Mark Levin program into the 5:00 pm to 8:00 pm slot. 
Philadelphia. Newsmax EVP of programming Elliot Jacobson states, “Growing up in a small Pennsylvania town next to a family-owned farm to covering big stories in some of the nation’s largest cities, Bob has developed a reporter’s instinct about the news that’s important to Americans.” Brooks comments, “I am glad to go national on a network like Newsmax, with a growing news brand and a team of talented professionals who care about news and the public’s right to know.” 
“SportsRadio 910 The Fan,” beginning Monday (9/11). In addition to his work as a sportswriter, Phillips has been a frequent guest on “The Fan.” Audacy Richmond SVP and market manager Bennett Zier states, “Michael Phillips, for many years, has been highly regarded as the most respected voice of Richmond and Virginia Sports. We are delighted to have MP wear our ‘910 The Fan’ jersey for Audacy Richmond.” Phillips previously served at the Richmond Times-Dispatch as sports editor and interim executive editor. 
add a Saturday edition of the program that will also air at 8:00 pm ET. FNC EVP of primetime programming Meade Cooper says, “Since joining the network in 2017, Mark has provided our audience with thought-provoking analysis on America’s core values and their impact on current events. We are looking forward to expanding his popular show to two nights a week.” Levin comments, “It’s an honor to join the other outstanding hosts on Saturday in bringing the most intelligent, informative and entertaining programming to the nation. Thank you to our loyal audience and FOX News.”
recently director of sales at the company’s Beaumont, Texas/Lake Charles, Louisiana operations. The cluster includes news/talk WJCW-AM, sports talk WXSM-AM and two music brands. Walker says, “I’m extremely excited to be joining our Tri-Cities team. Cumulus Media is a great company to be a part of, supporting its employees with many great resources for our success. I’m looking forward to the opportunity to serve our Tri-Cities team, advertisers, and community. I have family in the market and can’t wait to call Tri-Cities home.”
Donnarumma most recently served with Univision as president and GM for the company’s radio and TV assets in Arizona. iHeartMedia region president AJ Punjabi comments, “Joe epitomizes the excellence we champion across broadcasting, streaming, podcasts, live events, and our digital frontier. His vast experience magnifies our dedication to leading the audio-digital realm. With Joe, we’re not just adding a title – we’re harnessing a powerhouse of industry insight.”
place to be in the radio world than iHeartRadio. Thanks to the finest broadcasting executives around, Tom Cuddy, Thea Mitchem and Bernie Weiss for making it all happen. Walking to work every day is like walking through the Radio Hall of Fame. Just to get to my studio, I pass Elvis Duran, Jim Kerr, Charlamagne tha God, Angela Yee and other all-stars.” WOR program director Tom Cuddy adds, “When I joined WOR almost 11 years ago, Mark was my first hire. Since then, it’s been a blast watching Mark grow into becoming the highest-rated radio talk host in his time slot, along with digital numbers that are among the highest in the country.”
“Overreaction Monday” on September 4 that expands on the most popular segment of his flagship podcast, “The Rich Eisen Show,” into its own weekly podcast with Eisen and co-host Chris Brockman reflecting on the biggest fan- and hysterical media-driven overreactions from the previous weekend’s professional and college football games. To support his growing podcast network, Eisen has built an expanded studio and team in El Segundo, California with state-of-the-art recording equipment and set design. Eisen says, “Since joining the Cumulus family, they have shown unwavering support for my vision in growing my brand. As I have expanded my suite of services, they were the only ones I wanted to do business with, and I couldn’t think of a better place for my voice and productions to be heard over the coming years.” In addition to his podcast network, Eisen hosts the pregame and halftime shows for Westwood One’s syndicated “Monday Night Football” coverage and anchors “The Rich Eisen Show,” also syndicated by Westwood One for national radio.
Fitz,” that debuts on Saturday (9/9). In a joint statement, iHeartMedia Sports EVP of programming Don Martin and FSR SVP of programming Scott Shapiro say, “Jason’s addition is such a wonderful fit with the FOX Sports Radio team. Anthony and Jason will host such an electric show together, getting fans jazzed up for each weekend. This lineup has never been stronger or deeper – it’s everything stations need to deliver the most entertaining and engaging football coverage every weekend.”
Which is the more important “check the box” trait – persistence or passion?
work. In a Westword profile, Tubbs talks about his ascent in the news business, his plans for the “final chapter” of his working life, and his current film project about the deadly drug fentanyl. Locally, Tubbs has caused controversy with his 2020 documentary, Denver in Decay. About that film, Tubbs tells Westword, “That documentary kind of put me on the map as being one of the most hated media members by local politicians in Colorado in recent memory, and I embrace that. But with all the hate and praise, the one thing no one has ever said is that Denver in Decay is inaccurate. You can say all you want if you don’t like the messaging, but you can’t attack the accuracy or the credibility.” 
For decades the power-lunch spot in Manhattan was the beautiful Four Seasons restaurant. Check it out: 
across all demographics, while heavy listening (listening more than 8 hours per week) increased year-over-year. Also from the study: 1) The number of Americans listening to podcasts has increased by 45% in the last five years, and more than doubled in the past decade; 2) the jump in listening while in the car (or on public transportation) is noticeable across all age groups. It is now the most popular location to listen to podcasts among consumers 18-34 and 35-49. 
CFRB-AM, Toronto “Newstalk 1010” and as national format director, news & talk programming. Most recently he’s been a principal with RMR Media Strategies. Corus VP Ronnie Stanton comments, “Mike’s knowledge combined with Corus’s commitment to excellence sets the stage for a promising future for the world of talk radio.” The story indicates that Bendixen takes over for Amanda Cupido, who exits the company.